Scott DIY: How a Home Renovation Sparked a Viral Content Career
In this episode, Dan sits down with Scott Bagley (Scott DIY) to discuss his journey from marketing professional to full-time content creator in the home renovation space. Scott shares how he turned his DIY passion into a massive online presence, growing a loyal following on platforms like TikTok and Instagram.
Tune in for insights on overcoming content creation challenges, the power of storytelling, and strategies for building an engaged community. Scott also compares TikTok vs. Instagram and reveals how he’s used social media to grow his brand and connect with his audience authentically.
Follow Scott Bagley (Scott DIY):
This podcast is produced by dissident creative agency, the original disrupters of construction marketing. This podcast is born out of our passion to create conversations that push boundaries as hard as our content!
If breaking rules and standing out is your thing, we want to hear from you...
Transcript
Hello, and welcome to The Buildup. This is the podcast for marketing
Speaker:in the construction industry. I'm
Speaker:Dan, the creative director at Dissident. We've been working with construction brands for
Speaker:a number of years. It's an exciting and rapidly evolving industry, and
Speaker:that's why we created a podcast dedicated to the weird and wonderful world
Speaker:of construction marketing. I'll be speaking to leading brands, other agencies,
Speaker:creatives, influencers, and startups. This is the
Speaker:resource I wish we had when we first started out in the industry. Thank
Speaker:you for being here and welcome to The Builder. Welcome
Speaker:to The Buildup. I'm Dan, the creative director at Dissident. We are a social first
Speaker:creative agency working with construction brands to create hard
Speaker:hitting content and social media marketing. And today I'm
Speaker:joined by Scott DIY, Scott Bagley. Welcome
Speaker:I don't do intros because I know I almost screwed up your name as
Speaker:I do for most people. The pressure of names really gets to me for
Speaker:some reason, I don't know why. What I'd love for you to do is
Speaker:give a little introduction to yourself, kind of what you do currently
Speaker:Yeah sure so right now I am a full-time content
Speaker:creator and I produce content which is mainly based
Speaker:around my own project which is a home renovation and
Speaker:that is everything from bricklaying so
Speaker:the real nuts and bolts of construction all the way to painting
Speaker:walls and hanging picture frames. Not
Speaker:to be offensive to painting and decorators, it's a serious job, but
Speaker:that is literally every single job that's required in a renovation. That's
Speaker:I love it. And to your point on like hanging pictures and stuff like that, I
Speaker:am terrified about putting stuff in the walls and to hang pictures. I don't
Speaker:know why. There's a, there's a thing about it in our old studio. I actually got
Speaker:a guy in to come and put pictures up on the walls because I was just too scared. I
Speaker:Well, you know what's funny? Loads of customers feel the same. So I've done a
Speaker:little bit of work before this content creation with helping
Speaker:people locally with handyman jobs, right? And they're scared
Speaker:of putting pictures up on the wall. Two reasons. One is because they
Speaker:are sure in their mind that they're going to hit a pipe or a
Speaker:cable and it's going to kill them instantly. And then the
Speaker:other thing is getting it level as well. To make sure
Speaker:you get a picture level, it changes the whole aesthetics of the
Speaker:I mean, there's got to be a job, right, just for picture hangers, like, I'm sure
Speaker:that I'm sure that kind of thing exists in like stately homes and stuff like that,
Speaker:and perhaps even, you know, like, hotels
Speaker:and stuff, but domestic picture hangers, there's got to be
Speaker:Well I mean if you kind of know what you're doing with nails
Speaker:and knowing where to find things in walls then anyone should be pretty okay
Speaker:I still struggle though to be fair. It helps if you've
Speaker:got a laser level. Yeah I'd like a laser level. It really does help. That
Speaker:helps with so many jobs it's ridiculous. What's your go-to? Can
Speaker:you speak about that? Go-to laser level? Yeah. I mean Dewalt laser
Speaker:levels are the best in my opinion. I have used
Speaker:a, oh I can't even remember the brand, it's like a Lasgo laser
Speaker:level, it's quite cheap but it does the job and you can get some
Speaker:No idea. I know I'm sponsored by them. I like
Speaker:to say DeWalt. In their presence I
Speaker:said DeWalt and DeWalt and no one's bite
Speaker:Yeah, DeWalt's the one. I quite like to say caravan as well as opposed to
Speaker:caravan. You know what I mean? Extra emphasis on that an
Speaker:at the end. I don't know why. What do you think, Elan? Caravan? Caravan.
Speaker:You don't say tooth though, do you? You say tough. Tough, yeah.
Speaker:Yeah, so his opinion doesn't count anyway. by
Speaker:default, he's not allowed to have an opinion. We're not going to talk about scones and
Speaker:scones. No, not today, not today. Although it is worth mentioning
Speaker:to the viewers in the audience at home that
Speaker:the award for the least amount of travel
Speaker:time for a guest goes to you because you are literally what,
Speaker:Yeah, and I was still late. I always find like
Speaker:the closer you are to where you need to go, the later you'll be. If
Speaker:you've got a really long journey, you think, oh, I need to add at least 45 minutes onto
Speaker:It's true, actually. I had a mate in uni and he lived literally
Speaker:one door down from the uni. He was always the last one in. Yeah, yeah. 100%. That's
Speaker:a bit off topic, though. Today we're going to talk about kind of your
Speaker:backstory. I want to figure out how
Speaker:you got to where you are now. and kind of what you've
Speaker:learned along the way and what you see for the future of yourself
Speaker:and for the industry as a whole. But can you talk us through, so
Speaker:right now you are a full-time content creator, all
Speaker:the major social accounts and stuff you do incredibly well
Speaker:on. What brought you to this point? Because you've not
Speaker:I mean this story doesn't really start as you would expect a content
Speaker:creator story to start but maybe that's the best way.
Speaker:So I mean I kind of went into the
Speaker:world of work after finishing school thinking I don't know what I'm going to
Speaker:do you know like a lot of people. And I ended up doing
Speaker:an apprenticeship program, which was like a two-week thing
Speaker:where you'd spend time doing different trades. So it was all based around
Speaker:trades. It was with a program called PM Training based
Speaker:in Stoke-on-Trent. And in that two weeks, I
Speaker:did all different things. And maybe it was four weeks, actually. But anyway,
Speaker:I did carpentry, plumbing, all that type of stuff, painting and decorating. And
Speaker:I loved it all, engineering as well. And I
Speaker:also did, as well as all of those trade skills, which is
Speaker:quite strange, marketing. Marketing was thrown in there. In
Speaker:the apprenticeship? In the apprenticeship scheme. Why not? I love it. Yeah. So anyway,
Speaker:I did all of them, including marketing. And the day come after the four weeks
Speaker:to decide what it is that I wanted to do with my life from that point
Speaker:on. Big week. It all depends on
Speaker:if the people that you've done the work for want to work
Speaker:with you as well. So you make your choice and then check if they're okay with it. Anyway,
Speaker:I got feedback saying that they're all happy for me to
Speaker:go and work with them. And I actually really enjoyed all the trade jobs as
Speaker:well. In fact, I enjoyed painting and decorating the most, but that's probably
Speaker:because the lads are now the most fun at the time. And I was quite young,
Speaker:like 16, 17, something like that. 17. Yeah, anyway, so But
Speaker:the only person that actually turned up on the day to say, we
Speaker:want you to work with us, was the marketing manager for this company
Speaker:called Aspire Housing. It's a housing company. And yeah,
Speaker:so I just kind of said, well, they are pretty keen. And it
Speaker:pays a little bit more. So I'll do it. And that's how
Speaker:I got into marketing. And I came into marketing at a time
Speaker:where it was, social media was
Speaker:just becoming a thing, really. So, I
Speaker:mean, this is, I'm 32 now. I was 17 at
Speaker:the time. You know, that's, is that 2000 and,
Speaker:what is that? Is that 2008? I have no
Speaker:idea. Well, anyway. My maths
Speaker:is terrible. But anyway, it just so happened that I came in right at
Speaker:the beginning of this wave of social media into the corporate world. And
Speaker:I just basically just went head first into
Speaker:it. I was of the age, and no one else who was more senior than
Speaker:me. I was doing an apprenticeship, knew anything about social media. So
Speaker:I just dove into it. And the career just
Speaker:happened there in marketing. So I did
Speaker:that for 13 years. The problem is,
Speaker:although I was good at the job and I got some really big jobs
Speaker:in marketing as well, like for global brands and
Speaker:multiple brands, it was fantastic. No,
Speaker:so I moved on from Aspire after being there for about four
Speaker:years or so. And they paid for me to get a uni qualification
Speaker:as well, which was fantastic. And then I went on to private,
Speaker:so that was a third sector company. I went on to a private company,
Speaker:which was product marketing. And that was like, and
Speaker:that was really nice insight for me how fast paced that needed to be.
Speaker:Not agency though, right? Not agency, directly. That was that was
Speaker:Riedel. I'm not going to name all the companies I've worked for. But
Speaker:yeah, and anyway, and then I moved from there to another job, which
Speaker:was like a global group company. It was a massive opportunity and
Speaker:I just massively flourished in that as well. And my job essentially
Speaker:became looking after social media accounts
Speaker:for these big brands and looking after the influencer teams,
Speaker:finding, sourcing influencers, working with them to
Speaker:And what kind of year was this? This is like in the infancy of
Speaker:Yeah, so this kind of went in from, we should probably work out
Speaker:what those dates are, to be honest. So if
Speaker:Listen, you don't become a
Speaker:content creator and a creator because you're good
Speaker:Exactly. That happens afterwards. Yeah, that happens afterwards.
Speaker:So 2011. 2011, that's when I came in. Social media was booming. And then eventually, as
Speaker:I moved through these companies, I found a niche that
Speaker:I was particularly good at. really enjoyed and because it
Speaker:was all creative like I've always been a creative person. But
Speaker:the problem is those jobs didn't really resonate with
Speaker:me personally on one very significant level
Speaker:and that was because it wasn't physical enough. I've always been like a very physical
Speaker:person so I would always go to the gym after work and
Speaker:it would It would frustrate me that I
Speaker:sat behind a desk a lot of the time. You know, I'd beg for days when I can
Speaker:get out of the office and go and talk to people. Yeah, I'm also
Speaker:a very talkative person as well, so. Those two things went hand in
Speaker:hand. Anyway, as time
Speaker:went on, I was still in marketing and I had a
Speaker:bit of a wobble and I left marketing thinking, right, I need to go
Speaker:and do something else, but I don't know what it is. I was fortunate to have a bit
Speaker:of cash in the bank. So I thought I'd take six months off and
Speaker:really like assess my life, who I am, what I want to do, that type
Speaker:of thing. In the meantime, whilst I was doing that, I just kind of did a
Speaker:PT job, a pure gym, just because I love the gym and
Speaker:all that type of stuff. And I really enjoyed that. That was really cool. But
Speaker:then COVID hit whilst I was doing that part time job, which
Speaker:was ending all the gyms. So I thought, you know what, enough
Speaker:thinking, I haven't thought about what it is that I want to do. So I went back into
Speaker:marketing. And that's when I bought my first, I needed to
Speaker:buy my first house, COVID came. and
Speaker:the landlord of the house we were staying in needed to sell or
Speaker:wanted to sell and me and my partner had to move.
Speaker:We found out my partner was pregnant as well just as
Speaker:we'd found the house that we wanted to move into and it happened to be a
Speaker:full renovation and we was the top, top, top,
Speaker:top end of our budget and we had no room for
Speaker:making any of those amendments that we needed. So I just kind of
Speaker:went ahead with it anyway, because the bank had already signed off
Speaker:on it and we needed a place to live. So yeah, I just started kind
Speaker:of doing my own DIY. And that's
Speaker:kind of the story of how I got all of my social
Speaker:media expertise. the influencer stuff, I had
Speaker:a real good insight in from the corporate standpoint, you
Speaker:know, from the business side. And that was the beginning
Speaker:of my physical journey, which is the construction stuff that I
Speaker:So the, so when you started doing the renovations, did
Speaker:the renovations They had to happen anyway. And
Speaker:No. So I was in a position where we had this baby come
Speaker:in and I think it was five months from the day we moved in to when my
Speaker:partner gave birth. So I had to make as many changes to this house
Speaker:that would make it livable as possible. You need a full rewire, everything like
Speaker:that. Luckily by this point whilst I was doing that, when I started
Speaker:that six months off, I was doing the electrician's qualification. So
Speaker:I was learning about the physicality of like the
Speaker:build of a house and all that sort of stuff and learning
Speaker:about wiring a house. So when I moved into the house, I thought it'd be
Speaker:a good place for me to start giving it a go. And also
Speaker:all the other little jobs on the side as well. And it was like removing floors,
Speaker:putting floors back, you know, taking off old plaster, taking
Speaker:off old paper, wallpaper, that type of stuff. So I did that
Speaker:to a point where my partner gave birth and then The house
Speaker:was better, but not anywhere near like
Speaker:we wanted it. And the kitchen was pretty much unusable. And
Speaker:it had a very tiny extension on the back, which was so
Speaker:badly insulated, it had no cavity either, that the
Speaker:tiny radiator we had in that room, it was freezing in there the
Speaker:whole time. And with a newborn baby in the house and
Speaker:my partner, I just thought, well, why not
Speaker:knock that down and leave it open for six, seven months, you know? But
Speaker:no, the reality is like I was just seeing like pound notes flying out
Speaker:the back door because of all the expensive gas and electricity at
Speaker:the time. I knew that that wasn't going to come down, you
Speaker:know, so I'd have to do something about it. So I got a
Speaker:few builders around and I decided, and I asked them, would
Speaker:you be able to get onto this project and how fast can you do it and what's the price going to be?
Speaker:And I got some massive quotes, some like 35 grand,
Speaker:stuff like that. for someone with no money and no
Speaker:real way of getting that money either. It was almost an impossibility, but
Speaker:I knew it needed to be started. But one of the builders just said
Speaker:to me, tell you what, I could start in a few months time, but it'd
Speaker:be much quicker if you would dig the footings. And
Speaker:he said, I know that sounds crazy, but literally all you're doing is like
Speaker:knocking that building down there. There's nothing structural about it. And
Speaker:then just digging. a trench in the ground and he told
Speaker:me the dimensions I'd need to dig and I can get a building regulations company
Speaker:to check it and then he can come in and do the rest. Anyway I
Speaker:did that and he just said well you've come this far why
Speaker:don't you just you know try and do a little bit more and then so I
Speaker:did. So I just started learning how to bricklay and
Speaker:And during that process are you documenting pretty much
Speaker:Well I moved into the house not thinking about documenting anything and
Speaker:then I did a build in the garden which was like a bit of
Speaker:a brick garage extension and I did that as like a
Speaker:trial run really kind of like what can I do
Speaker:you know this is a bit of fun we need that and that
Speaker:that went really well and it was
Speaker:only at that point I kind of thought I need to start recording
Speaker:what I'm doing because I'm going to forget this in the future. I'm going
Speaker:to forget that like the struggles and the time I went through in
Speaker:order to do this thing with no experience. So I'm going to record
Speaker:it for myself and then when I had some footage all together I
Speaker:kind of thought one day, and I was at a new marketing job at this point,
Speaker:and I'd been there for like a year, and I was on
Speaker:my lunch break, and I thought, I've just made some good videos for
Speaker:this company. I'm going to make one for myself, using the
Speaker:footage of this build that I've just done. And I'm just going to find a
Speaker:trending audio and put that over the top of it. And I posted that on TikTok,
Speaker:which is the first ever video I posted on any platform for
Speaker:myself. And that went viral. And first one, yeah. yeah
Speaker:and you know what I've had some negativity around that I've had a lot of people saying
Speaker:like you know why you've come out of nowhere you've got all this followers and I've
Speaker:been doing this for 10 years or whatever and all that and
Speaker:and like or five years or four years whatever and and
Speaker:then I just reply back well I've been doing this for 13 years.
Speaker:Yeah. Ever since social media was a thing, I've been doing this for brands. Yeah.
Speaker:It's, it's, I know it's one of them kind of things. It's just like, like it
Speaker:is. You can't fathom the negativity on,
Speaker:especially on TikTok, but on social media in general, people just want
Speaker:to complain. And it's like, just
Speaker:Yeah. And you know what's funny is I never expected from
Speaker:trades, tradies, you know, I just I've always, you know, There's
Speaker:just kind of that thing of that, you know, you expect traders to
Speaker:be kind of humble and, and kind of like helpful and
Speaker:caring and, and, you know, in support of their fellow, you know,
Speaker:like a man or trader, whatever. Um,
Speaker:uh, but then you just get some keyboard warriors. They exist everywhere and
Speaker:And I've seen my fair share of them. I've experienced
Speaker:every way that someone can be negative and positive, I
Speaker:think, online. And that has definitely had an impact on
Speaker:me. And in a way that like now, maybe I
Speaker:haven't been doing it that long, but I do feel completely desensitized. to
Speaker:any comment that anyone makes. Someone could be saying, this is the
Speaker:best thing I've ever seen in my life. You've changed my life because I've gone and
Speaker:done this, that and the other. And that will be almost like over
Speaker:my head. And it's exactly the same for all of the bad stuff
Speaker:that people say. It's over my head. It really The
Speaker:only time I think anyone could ever, and I'm going to say this and then people are
Speaker:going to try start doing this, but the only time someone could
Speaker:ever really knock me in a way is if it's someone
Speaker:that clearly really knows their stuff and
Speaker:makes a very good point in the comments that I have actually done
Speaker:something wrong and I shouldn't be showing other people that because it's actually
Speaker:wrong. Which hasn't happened because
Speaker:I do a lot of research before I do anything to make sure that what I'm
Speaker:putting out there you know, is safe, it is okay to
Speaker:do. It might not be the best way of doing it, I haven't been in the trade that
Speaker:long, but it's not wrong and it's not, you know, it's
Speaker:You know, I'm finding more and more that we work with
Speaker:tradespeople rather than brands, you know, because when you work with a brand,
Speaker:you get to learn. Let's say we didn't have any, any interaction with
Speaker:tradespeople. Um, and we work with the brand and we get to understand what their,
Speaker:their product does. We get to know the applications, but we don't get
Speaker:to understand the nuances of, of, um, of, of the applications and
Speaker:of the, you know, the, the different creative ways that that product can be
Speaker:used. And I've said this a number of times, like, you know, trades
Speaker:and, and, DIY, it's really
Speaker:just creativity. It's just about problem solving, isn't it? And it's amazing.
Speaker:I watch videos of Mark
Speaker:Tiff's a really good example. I watched some of his videos on YouTube. And
Speaker:he's like, I've just found out this way of doing this. And
Speaker:I'm like, and it's, I'd usually do it this way. But now I figured
Speaker:out that I can do it this way. What do you guys think? Do you know any other ways? And you've seen
Speaker:the comments all the other ways that that could have been done? Yeah. And it's like,
Speaker:no way, like, there's so much subjectivity in
Speaker:Yeah it's great. Yeah I love it when I see someone with a little trick that
Speaker:just makes things so much easier and you see that
Speaker:and again that coming back to what you said at the beginning of this podcast
Speaker:it was literally about how people are
Speaker:making content as a builder and
Speaker:who are they making that content for. Are they making it for a customer or are
Speaker:they making it for a brand or other tradies just
Speaker:You know, yeah, it's it's I just I think it's
Speaker:I think it's amazing. So we've got to the point where you started
Speaker:to document the stuff that you're doing on social media. So
Speaker:the stuff you're doing with the with the build with the renovation, which you're still living in, right? Yeah.
Speaker:But is there a pivotal point where you go,
Speaker:I'm going to go full bore on this and actually make something
Speaker:of this? Do you have like a little sort of light
Speaker:Yeah, the light bulb moment was a crazy moment in
Speaker:my life. And it's something that me and my partner will always remember. It
Speaker:was literally like game changing in a day. So
Speaker:I can remember it
Speaker:was straight after Christmas and maybe
Speaker:the second day or first day back at work in my
Speaker:marketing job and I was dreading going back like everyone
Speaker:does. But like I had this real pit about going back. I knew
Speaker:it wasn't what I wanted to do long term. And there
Speaker:was a, the extension was pretty much done
Speaker:at that point. So I hadn't rendered the exterior or
Speaker:finished the interior at all, but the exterior was done. And
Speaker:I got a load of messages after posting a TikTok,
Speaker:which reached 7.5 million people at the time. about
Speaker:how much it cost me to make this extension. It
Speaker:cost £9,200 to build an extension and
Speaker:that was just materials and that blew up online. Got
Speaker:some hate as well on that just because of you know builders charging a
Speaker:lot more but they need to because it's labour and that's how they get paid. That's
Speaker:just the material cost. Yeah I think they missed that a little bit though. Anyway
Speaker:I got loads of inquiries from like national press basically and
Speaker:I was on the radio and I had loads of these like little like interview
Speaker:type things set up and it was that moment when my
Speaker:partner said to me I was just about to go on the radio and she says you need
Speaker:to make an Instagram account right now, like right
Speaker:now because and this is like half an hour before I'm about
Speaker:to go on radio, never been on radio before in my life. and she
Speaker:said like people are going to look you up straight away whilst you're talking
Speaker:so get it done right now. And I was starting to panic because I was like
Speaker:you know like I got this account made. Because you were purely TikTok at that point? Purely TikTok
Speaker:yeah. And the reason why I started on TikTok is because it's more of
Speaker:a community where you can talk with people. So originally
Speaker:my content was like, this is what I'm doing, and if any
Speaker:experts out there know how I could do it better or could give me advice for
Speaker:the next step, please do. So I might make a video saying, you know,
Speaker:builders of TikTok, I need your help. I've got these bricks in
Speaker:front of me, but they don't measure the same, and I need
Speaker:to know how to lay them properly. and and i'd get responses and
Speaker:that was built that built a really warm community you
Speaker:know so that going back to the question of when
Speaker:was that day it was the literally the the maybe
Speaker:third or the fifth of january i think it might have been the fifth of january and
Speaker:I handed my notice in and I was on radio two
Speaker:days later I think it was and I started this
Speaker:Instagram account on the same day as the radio. I started posting
Speaker:some of my posts from TikTok on Instagram just so
Speaker:it was like a portfolio and within I
Speaker:don't know, a week I had like 70k followers and
Speaker:then you know another week went by and it was like 100k.
Speaker:It really went through the roof and I
Speaker:Yeah and do you find, do you think that the, because that's massive growth,
Speaker:70k is absolutely insane. in
Speaker:any, in a year, let alone anything shorter than
Speaker:that. Were there like other factors
Speaker:that kind of led to that? Like you mentioned like you were on radio and stuff, but there's sort of
Speaker:other things kind of feeding the Instagram and feeding the interest or was it
Speaker:It was an absolute perfect storm of media channels.
Speaker:So I already had a reputation and a
Speaker:following on TikTok. At that point I think I was at 60k followers
Speaker:on TikTok. Not too bad. I had 60K
Speaker:followers and I had loads of content backed up.
Speaker:I was brand new to Instagram. And there's a thing with the
Speaker:algorithm on Instagram. If you create an account and you don't post for
Speaker:a long time, it kind of puts you in a category. Whereas if
Speaker:you open an account and just start posting quite freely, it
Speaker:means you're very active. So I had all this content and I was posting
Speaker:like a piece of viral content every day. So
Speaker:I knew that that content was already viral because it had done so well on TikTok. And
Speaker:I was posting a viral piece of content every single day and
Speaker:people were literally flooding in to watch it. That's genius. The
Speaker:other side of the coin is traditional marketing, you
Speaker:know, the PR side. all of national media
Speaker:was talking about this guy who just built an extension with no experience and
Speaker:I mean all of national media like it was everywhere. And
Speaker:then obviously there was the radio and I was
Speaker:on GB news as well and you know like actual you
Speaker:know on webcam so it was kind of yeah it just went
Speaker:So that hook then for the audience, this guy
Speaker:with no experience has built an extension for nine
Speaker:grand. Was that unheard of? And
Speaker:were you aware of the importance of that at the time?
Speaker:When you started doing this, were you like, no one's ever done this before. It's
Speaker:Yeah, honestly, I had to do this extension. In my mind,
Speaker:in my mind, I had to do this extension because the
Speaker:house was in such bad shape. We were losing all this heat, we were paying loads
Speaker:of bills, like it needed to be done. I felt like I could do
Speaker:it. My partner also said she felt like I could do
Speaker:it as well with absolutely no proof. because
Speaker:I'd never done it before. But I was just willing. And
Speaker:so I just kind of cracked on with it. And it took me
Speaker:a long time. And I had this amazing community of people on
Speaker:TikTok, which I'll always be grateful for because they did
Speaker:help me out through some like really difficult spots, you know, difficult questions that
Speaker:The, so the interesting thing is, cause so, so it, your journey started
Speaker:on TikTok and it's, and it, well, it's, it's, it's essentially grown from
Speaker:there. Um, so you started off on TikTok. Um,
Speaker:your partner, um, asked, mentioned that you should probably start an
Speaker:Instagram and you've rushed to start an Instagram. You started posting
Speaker:on that. And I've got your stats as of yesterday, they may have gone up, um,
Speaker:since then. Um, 36 and
Speaker:a half K on YouTube. Yeah, respectable. Thanks.
Speaker:190k on TikTok. It's pretty insane, right? I think
Speaker:it's 191 today. 191. 81k on Facebook, which
Speaker:is the one that everyone's trying to get away from. But actually,
Speaker:I think it's kind of coming, but it's creeping back. 408k
Speaker:on Instagram, again, potentially more today, because I checked these numbers yesterday.
Speaker:Like, was there a strategy to go big on
Speaker:Instagram? Because that's a bit, that's a big difference. 190k on TikTok, which
Speaker:was your first platform and then 408k as a result. Is
Speaker:it, did you put more of your eggs into Instagram? Or
Speaker:is Instagram one of those things that's easier to build? Or does it suit
Speaker:your content more? Why are the numbers so
Speaker:Well, Instagram, so I'd already built a really nice warm
Speaker:community on TikTok. So when I went over to Instagram, I
Speaker:knew that I had a lot of videos, but I
Speaker:didn't have that longevity of conversation
Speaker:and community building on there. So that was my
Speaker:priority once I started that account to obviously keep
Speaker:TikTok flowing as it was normally, but to build a
Speaker:warm community on Instagram as well. Because what I didn't want to happen, which
Speaker:does happen to some people, is that you have all these viral videos and it goes through
Speaker:the roof and then all of a sudden they start losing
Speaker:followers because that one little story that they did isn't interesting anymore.
Speaker:It's the one thing. So I wanted to build a really warm community. So
Speaker:I did kind of lean more into Instagram. And as a
Speaker:result, it did pick up a lot of followers. And
Speaker:I think the reason why TikTok hasn't followed suit, there
Speaker:was a massive TikTok algorithm change,
Speaker:which you'll hear every single content creator talk about, which
Speaker:was when they brought in their content creator program,
Speaker:like it's like a beta payment program or
Speaker:something. I don't really know the proper name for it, but essentially it's
Speaker:a new payment method for paying content creators based on
Speaker:views. And when that came in and
Speaker:content had to be over one minute long, that
Speaker:changed the game on that platform. And
Speaker:it just, and they brought in loads of adverts and stuff. And my love for that
Speaker:platform slowly died away. Not for
Speaker:the people and, you know, providing the content still, but
Speaker:for the way the platform was going. Whereas Instagram, I
Speaker:was finding that the people in the comments were
Speaker:very well-meaning. So they might not have been, it might
Speaker:not be as um savage community
Speaker:and savage meaning like purely truthful what people think and
Speaker:they tell you what it's not that type of savage uh but
Speaker:it's very much like high positivity on instagram so
Speaker:it was a nice place to be and i was making content for instagram mainly
Speaker:then you'd rather be there yeah yeah if there's a if there's a kind of
Speaker:hostile environment over here and a nice place to be over here with some warm and
Speaker:But I'm right in saying Instagram, currently,
Speaker:it's not a paid platform, you can't get revenue from Instagram, you can for
Speaker:Facebook, you can for YouTube, you can
Speaker:from TikTok. So it's an interesting kind
Speaker:of, because you could have made some money there, couldn't you? And I'm sure you do
Speaker:in terms of like TikTok and YouTube, and you have
Speaker:the ability to do that. But even still, you've kind of gone, actually,
Speaker:these are my people over here, a place where I'm not going to make any money from
Speaker:the actual platform, which is interesting. So that
Speaker:was a good point. But you still keep all these profiles taken
Speaker:over. You're still making content for each of those. In
Speaker:terms of like, because you're one person, you
Speaker:know, I'm sure you get little bits of help from here
Speaker:and there and support. Do you have
Speaker:a completely different content strategy for
Speaker:each platform? I mean, specifically, I get YouTube's long form as
Speaker:a rule, apart from your shorts and stuff like that. Do
Speaker:you cross pollinate like from TikTok and Instagram and stuff? Is that part
Speaker:So if I had the time, it would be unique. I know exactly what works
Speaker:on what platform and what doesn't. And all I
Speaker:kind of have to choose one platform to prioritize over any
Speaker:other. At the moment I'm prioritizing Instagram first content.
Speaker:Instagram first content's a little bit more curated, higher
Speaker:quality, and it's just, um, It's
Speaker:a nice way of storytelling. It's a nice place
Speaker:to be, like I said before, whereas TikTok is more conversational,
Speaker:a bit more raw. And I'd love
Speaker:to be able to do that type of content. In fact, it takes half the time it does
Speaker:on Instagram. But I've got to spend my time
Speaker:somewhere, and I'm putting it into Instagram at the moment. And the reason why
Speaker:I'm doing that is because I'm staying true to
Speaker:what I personally want to do when it
Speaker:comes to delivering my content, my journey, my story. And
Speaker:although that might not always result in the best views and
Speaker:the best engagement, what I need to do is
Speaker:create a profile that accurately reflects what it's like
Speaker:for somebody to go through a renovation as a DIYer. And
Speaker:that's going to be important for me many years in the future because I want to be able to look
Speaker:back on this. I want to look back on these videos and go, that is
Speaker:genuinely what I thought and did at the time. I
Speaker:don't want to sugarcoat that. This is a, this is really a vlog. It's
Speaker:I think it's got to be, um, the longevity of
Speaker:it is, is, is a huge part of this as well, isn't it? So if you, and
Speaker:what I mean by that is if, if you're trying to create content for Instagram,
Speaker:which you actually enjoy making, and that's, you know, your favoured, um,
Speaker:and more natural way of making content. But then there's a strategy for
Speaker:TikTok, which is less aligned with, you know, your,
Speaker:um, not values, but you know what I mean? Like how, what you enjoy
Speaker:more. Um, it becomes, it can become harder to maintain
Speaker:that if you're trying to do all those kinds of things. Whereas I think you're right. If you prioritize
Speaker:and a lot of brands will do this as well, because they don't have the budget necessarily to
Speaker:have specific strategies and completely separate content for
Speaker:each platform. They'll prioritize one, but it's still good to show up
Speaker:Yeah, I mean, the thing is, is like it started off with
Speaker:a priority on TikTok and a brand could do exactly the same. So like
Speaker:when I've worked for companies, we prioritize an account. We have so much time and
Speaker:resources, you know, that staff time, video time, everything, you
Speaker:know, money to pay influencers. We have to choose a platform and
Speaker:then just focus on whatever that that is going to be. And and
Speaker:then once you've had success there, you feel like you've built that audience, you've completed the
Speaker:goals that you had in mind. Yeah. Move on to the next one. Yeah. For
Speaker:Yeah, long form. Yeah. I love a bit of long form. I love storytelling. And
Speaker:I'm excited for this
Speaker:kind of resurgence of long form. Because I'm like, I'm
Speaker:the guy that's on the telly, like my YouTube's on
Speaker:my TV. And I'm like, in the evenings, watching
Speaker:it on my TV. I love my long form stuff, my 15 minute, 20 minute videos.
Speaker:I'm exactly the same. That's, that's my, that's my television. Like, when
Speaker:I run out of stuff to watch on my recommended and my subscriptions on
Speaker:YouTube, I'm like, what am I going to do for the rest of
Speaker:I just I just like reach for the Xbox for the PlayStation controller. Yeah.
Speaker:So massive success across multiple platforms and
Speaker:and building a great community. Are there certain things
Speaker:that you've done? along those
Speaker:lines. Let's specifically talk about Instagram because it's easier to pinpoint
Speaker:one. Are there certain things that you've done to
Speaker:make that happen in terms of either tactics, strategies, consistency?
Speaker:Are there certain elements of your content and what you've
Speaker:Yeah, I mean, the success comes from
Speaker:the main element, which is storytelling. And
Speaker:storytelling is something I've invested in a lot
Speaker:in my own learning. So when I first started this
Speaker:journey, I was under the impression that
Speaker:the way I spoke and my accent was seen as
Speaker:a negative. And that is definitely the way I came
Speaker:into this journey. there was a guy,
Speaker:Vinny something, he does workshops
Speaker:on TikTok mainly about speaking confidently in
Speaker:front of people. I never did one of the workshops but one of his
Speaker:videos triggered me into starting
Speaker:the storytelling which I'm known for today. which
Speaker:is basically, if you think that you're bad at talking to people, you
Speaker:can change that. You're not born that way. It is something you
Speaker:can learn and improve on. And all you have to
Speaker:do is practice it. And I don't know why I needed to be told that,
Speaker:but for some reason I did. And after
Speaker:watching that TikTok video, I sat back, I was like, Oh,
Speaker:I could be good at that. So then I started literally
Speaker:practicing getting a camera, talking to my phone, and
Speaker:stories, Instagram stories has helped me improve a lot. And
Speaker:that's just helped me refine the way that I deliver anything. And
Speaker:that's how I've been able to deliver this
Speaker:high quality storytelling through my social
Speaker:media platforms. Massive, just massive amounts of
Speaker:And you are, everyone knows you as the person that they could listen to
Speaker:to go to sleep, like people love your voice. And
Speaker:I've never known people say anything particularly nice about the Stoke accent.
Speaker:I think you're like an
Speaker:anomaly for people in Stoke that just
Speaker:I don't understand it because I always saw when I was in the corporate world
Speaker:as well, I always saw my voice as a,
Speaker:an issue. I know that sounds, that sounds crazy, but
Speaker:I remember so many times sitting in meetings, especially like
Speaker:when I go abroad, like I used to have to go to New York a lot and
Speaker:we'd all be in like a big boardroom, very important people there. And
Speaker:as soon as I start speaking and not just because they're American or
Speaker:whatever, it was almost like the, that no
Speaker:matter what I said, they would switch off a little bit.
Speaker:And I think it was down to the accent. And I couldn't quite
Speaker:put my finger on what it was. So back then, where even in
Speaker:an office environment, I'd find a way of creating a
Speaker:hook. And in the same way that you create a hook for a
Speaker:social media video, like, I can't believe that removing one
Speaker:brick can make your whole house fall down. That's a hook, right?
Speaker:And how do you hook people's attention in
Speaker:a corporate environment as well? Because you need to. The
Speaker:boss hears and speaks to lots of different people. And
Speaker:if you want to pitch a new idea, you've got to get his attention. You
Speaker:know, did you realize that influencer marketing can
Speaker:increase our visibility by 2 million views
Speaker:and we only have to spend 10 grand to do it? That's a hook in a corporate environment
Speaker:because then your boss is listening and you've got to have the information to back it up.
Speaker:So that's kind of like where I started learning those hooks and
Speaker:Build tactics around the fact that you didn't have confidence in your own voice and accent.
Speaker:Yeah. I remember the first time I think first
Speaker:time I met you was at an event that one of our clients was putting on. And
Speaker:it was the home improvements channel, where they
Speaker:were there and and they were like, you need to speak to Scott, he's got the most beautiful voice
Speaker:ever. And then I'm like, and I was like, Oh, he's speaking
Speaker:someone in the moment, I think you were on the road in front of us on the bus on
Speaker:the way back to the hotel. And, and,
Speaker:and I could hear you talking. I'm like, Sounds like he's from Stoke.
Speaker:And I've got Molly with me, who's like five minutes
Speaker:down the road from me, so I was around the corner. So people on
Speaker:Destin will know her voice relatively well. And
Speaker:yeah, it was like, it was such a mad thing. I'm like, it's just like, she's
Speaker:down the road from Molly and 10 minutes down the road from, you
Speaker:and uh small world yeah but even even back
Speaker:then you were like his voice is so amazing i could just listen to him for
Speaker:for hours and then you were you were sold on the fact
Speaker:that you you people didn't like it yeah but i don't know whether that's because
Speaker:i trained it to be this way oh right okay like i don't
Speaker:i don't know i i can't i don't have anything to reference my
Speaker:voice against it from the past because i never i would purposely never be
Speaker:in front of a camera Like I've never had any experience of that in
Speaker:the corporate environment, never had to talk about anything on camera. So
Speaker:it was literally just like learning how to talk, not
Speaker:Irmin and Arin every time I spoke. It's literally, it's something that
Speaker:anyone can practice. And maybe, maybe that is the thing that's
Speaker:Maybe. And to be fair, you know, We're not, we
Speaker:don't, we don't have to say everything nice about the Stoke accent and the Stoke voice.
Speaker:There's some wailing screeching Stoke that's knocking about, isn't there? You know, we all
Speaker:know them, you know what I mean? Like at the school gates. But
Speaker:as a ruler, yeah, I think, I think, I think the Stoke accent,
Speaker:especially like a really soft one like yours is like really endearing. I
Speaker:think, I think people outside of, not that your whole, the
Speaker:whole of this podcast should be about the value of
Speaker:Stoke. Scott's accent, but I
Speaker:think people outside sort of think of it as somewhere between like sort of
Speaker:Liverpool and like West Midlands or something like that. I
Speaker:was in Teesside the other day and these guys were adamant
Speaker:they didn't sound like Geordies. I'm like you're having a laugh aren't you?
Speaker:But actually it's like somewhere between like Geordie and Leeds or
Speaker:It's definitely something that I've got in mind that I want to go into more.
Speaker:Like, if people like my voice and that's just a general consensus,
Speaker:then I'd definitely like to go into doing more. I've done a radio advert.
Speaker:So, you know, that again, it's that endearing thing, maybe a trustworthy
Speaker:northerner voice, because that's what we go for. Children's books,
Speaker:anything, I don't know. It's just a bit of fun at the end of the day.
Speaker:I love it. I love it. I think you'd be great at that. So
Speaker:I watch your content, and I find it really interesting. And
Speaker:you mentioned storytelling. And when I watched your films, I
Speaker:think about all the planning that goes, that's involved with the setting up of these
Speaker:shots and the fact that you are one person kind of, you
Speaker:know, filming this stuff and the challenges around that. Can
Speaker:you talk to us about the challenges of having this kind of storytelling mentality? Is
Speaker:Well, I mean, I read something, I read something not long ago.
Speaker:It was about influences and burnout. And
Speaker:apparently 73%, I think I'm
Speaker:remembering that right, have suffered burnout and
Speaker:therefore leave the social media content
Speaker:creation game for good because it's that intense, right?
Speaker:My YouTube subscriptions is completely dead at the moment. I don't know whether yours
Speaker:is the same but like a year ago it was like the heyday of like
Speaker:YouTube and like these days I'm like where's my favorite creators? They've
Speaker:I know it sounds it sounds bonkers and it
Speaker:would sound bonkers to me if I wasn't a content creator as
Speaker:well that the people who are an influencer could
Speaker:suffer burnout because it seems like such an amazing way of life. You
Speaker:can just do what you want all the time and but actually what
Speaker:you've just alluded to there with the the level of
Speaker:planning that goes into not only the physical
Speaker:project of doing the DIY job and learning about how
Speaker:all that works, to then moving the camera around for
Speaker:all the different angles and just, you know, the
Speaker:audio of it all as well, because you need to capture some ASMR. It
Speaker:is, and it is hard. I'm working seven days a week at
Speaker:the moment, and I'm not saying this for anyone to have sympathy for me, like
Speaker:I'm living my dream at the moment, but I am working hard for
Speaker:Yeah, yeah, it's not an easy ride, is it? And basically you have to,
Speaker:a lot of these guys, especially people like yourself, you aren't just like, you're
Speaker:a really good kind of metaphor or an
Speaker:anti-metaphor for your uh type of content is
Speaker:is that the opposite of run and gun you know what i mean this is pre-thought out
Speaker:pre-planned content um that's got a story attached to it
Speaker:you could almost write the script ahead of time and figure out the shots from there
Speaker:um that's a that's a video production company's like
Speaker:skill set but in uh for for your your
Speaker:perhaps um skill set prior to doing this has probably been
Speaker:quite helpful but for a lot of guys who don't have a
Speaker:media degree and stuff like that, it's got to be a massive
Speaker:challenge for them and something they're not used to and there'll be
Speaker:a lot of doubt in their heads about what they're doing,
Speaker:if they're doing it right, what's working and stuff like that. And so
Speaker:not only have you got to do all that kind of stuff, also you've got
Speaker:to film yourself and actually get it right, get
Speaker:the thing right. I mean it's okay to make mistakes obviously in DIY and construction, but
Speaker:ideally you want to be seen as doing a good job of
Speaker:the thing that you're that you're doing, especially if it's your actual if
Speaker:it's your actual trade. So yeah, hugely, hugely difficult,
Speaker:but you know, your type, your type of
Speaker:content compared to someone who's just doing doing lots of you
Speaker:know, cutaways and transitions, and it's kind of moving and sexy, and
Speaker:that's great content again, but it's kind of, for that kind of stuff, there's
Speaker:still a lot of planning, but there's more room for
Speaker:It's originality, right? So again, and
Speaker:I've had a lot of people, including other influencers, say to
Speaker:me, why don't you just make it a little bit easier for yourself and make some videos
Speaker:which are just, you know, really fast paced, nice camera angles, ASMR
Speaker:type stuff. And I do that sometimes when, when
Speaker:I'm planning the next thing in the run of content,
Speaker:you know, just to keep things going. But for me, my content
Speaker:creation journey is all about creating original content that I haven't
Speaker:seen elsewhere. Okay, I might pull some ideas in
Speaker:from other places online, like everyone does, but just not
Speaker:copying and pasting, doing my own thing and getting it
Speaker:right and making because the doubt comes in, just
Speaker:like you said. You know, you doubt yourself. So I want to push myself to
Speaker:the nth degree and find that I
Speaker:am good and back that up, you know, by success. And
Speaker:that kind of comes through to different types of content creators that
Speaker:businesses work with and what are they actually paying
Speaker:for, you know. When a business works with me,
Speaker:they're paying for somebody who is thinking about it
Speaker:from a story film perspective, you know, so I'm
Speaker:giving a feel for the product or brand as
Speaker:well as showing it and talking through it. I also have the
Speaker:authenticity of my account as well, which, you
Speaker:know, I'll never be bought out. I only use things that I believe in. And
Speaker:that all plays into my type
Speaker:of content creation. Whereas there are other content creators who
Speaker:might just take a picture of a floor that's just been laid or just
Speaker:do some nice shots of mixing up the adhesive. And
Speaker:although that does make very quick viral content,
Speaker:you know, virality, but it doesn't stick in someone's
Speaker:mind. you know, that that content is there one minute gone
Speaker:the next. And one of the reasons why I'm going more towards YouTube
Speaker:is because I want a legacy. Yeah. You know, I want to put those that
Speaker:storytelling and high quality content creation
Speaker:and DIY and construction into a long term format.
Speaker:And I think the only way to really do that and really get good at
Speaker:And I, I honestly feel like YouTube influencers,
Speaker:let's call them that because it's easier for
Speaker:the world to understand, but I would consider some of the guys that I follow on
Speaker:YouTube not to be influencers, but they technically are. They influence a lot of
Speaker:people, but they're essentially a channel, a content creator.
Speaker:Those guys, if they say I've got this and it's interesting, I'm
Speaker:already on Amazon, I'm getting that thing. It's such
Speaker:a valuable, because you, I don't know, you
Speaker:almost build a relation, more of a relationship um
Speaker:with the audience on YouTube and you know vice
Speaker:versa like that there's people on YouTube I'm just desperate
Speaker:for them to make a film and even if it's they make a film about something I'm not that interested in
Speaker:yeah you want to catch up yeah I love it I love YouTube
Speaker:so much and You know, Instagram is a great platform. And
Speaker:I think the two combined are great because obviously you can do shorter
Speaker:pieces of content, which means you can do more content on Instagram. And
Speaker:That's where TikTok started for me. Yeah, it's all about that community. And
Speaker:what's the next step in that journey? You know, a stable platform
Speaker:So storytelling content, that content will of course vary.
Speaker:You'll want to mix it up every now and again, you want to change some stuff up, you want to
Speaker:be not creating the same thing over and over again. But there are
Speaker:particular trends in,
Speaker:I'm using the word trend lightly, in the
Speaker:types of content that you're audiences engaging with more
Speaker:these days? For instance, like, are you doing certain things
Speaker:that you go, Oh, this is getting more engagement than usual, or whatever,
Speaker:if you notice in certain areas of your content being like more,
Speaker:It depends, again, what you're classing. So if
Speaker:we're looking at success factors, what success factors
Speaker:are we looking at? Is it reach? Is it engagement? And
Speaker:what is the sentiment? Are people
Speaker:saving it because it's, wow, I can't let that go. I need to come back to that. And
Speaker:that's something I think about when I'm making the video. So
Speaker:I will usually make a video for, either
Speaker:max views which help me reach new people
Speaker:and open me up to a larger audience. Those are usually
Speaker:quite generic videos which might be seasonal based
Speaker:content around something that a lot of people can relate
Speaker:to. An example of that might be, just
Speaker:thinking off the top of my head, It's autumn, leaves
Speaker:fall in autumn. What's the fastest way to get all the leaves off
Speaker:your drive? And I've come up with that
Speaker:solution and you're going to watch it. And that's your, that's
Speaker:your, that's your viral view. Someone's going to watch and go, wow, that was cool.
Speaker:next yes you know and then maybe forget about it yeah and
Speaker:and then you've got the engagement which is um i'm
Speaker:just about to put the top on a bench and i've got these
Speaker:two different types of wood and i think i've chosen this
Speaker:one because i like the color but i'm not sure how much it's going to perform if
Speaker:you know anything about this type of timber make
Speaker:sure you comment because I really need that help. There's your engagement
Speaker:piece. And then the saving piece is all
Speaker:about like, this is how I've made a coffee corner
Speaker:out of, you know, £50 worth
Speaker:of materials, start to finish. And then someone's going
Speaker:to watch and go, I could do that myself, save. And that also
Speaker:can be viral. They all can merge a little bit into the others, but the
Speaker:And then if you talk all of those together, I know we've got different factors of
Speaker:like what we class as engagement. What do you
Speaker:think kind of subjectively
Speaker:your audience enjoys the most, like your fans, like what
Speaker:I, do you know what it is? I quite, it sounds horrible
Speaker:and this isn't necessarily on you, I like to see you suffer
Speaker:and then see how you come through. It's that kind of hero arc
Speaker:of just like, he's come across a problem but I know his
Speaker:wife, is Poipana a wife? And daughter have
Speaker:got to get but they're coming home and he's got to fix this
Speaker:You know, that kind of thing. Yeah. So I also, when
Speaker:sometimes I'll start doing it with no idea
Speaker:what the story is going to look like. Sometimes I have to do the project and then the
Speaker:story just emerges as I'm doing it. You know, I knew that I was on
Speaker:a timescale with a particular project and it had to be done before my partner gets
Speaker:home. So obviously the storyline that's going to keep someone
Speaker:hooked is that really classic storyline that comes
Speaker:back to learning about storytelling of hero meets
Speaker:problem. Problem is almost too much to overcome,
Speaker:but then he does overcome it and everyone's happy at the end. You know, you
Speaker:can change that a couple of different ways, but that's the way. And so
Speaker:you can weave that into your content for sure. But what
Speaker:are they coming back for? To be honest, I think a
Speaker:lot of people are coming back to check in. Like
Speaker:you just said with YouTube, because it's
Speaker:a very long series that people have followed for now two
Speaker:years, they're literally coming back, not for a particular
Speaker:project, but literally to see what I'm doing
Speaker:now. The familiar face online that they know. and
Speaker:I share a lot through stories as well, so people get the BTS
Speaker:as well, you know of like in the moment, oh no
Speaker:Yeah I like that, it's nice to hear that kind of like, You
Speaker:know, like this stuff that this stuff that works and
Speaker:this stuff that like brands like to see, but what's the stuff you, your fans
Speaker:want to see, you know what I mean? Like, cause a lot of the time you just, sometimes
Speaker:you just have to make stuff for your audience, uh, regardless of
Speaker:whether it's going to have any particular metrics or whatever, but then how do you, how
Speaker:do you get those metrics? You know, how do you get enjoyment metrics?
Speaker:Yeah, I mean, how do you understand why they're coming back? The
Speaker:only way I could, the only way I've been able to think about it
Speaker:is that they just want to catch up and see what I'm doing. And
Speaker:there's definitely types of content that go more
Speaker:viral than others. And that is the relatable, seasonal
Speaker:based content. You know, it's something that's hard hitting right now that most
Speaker:Yeah, absolutely. Last
Speaker:question before I won't get into like probably what is the most valuable piece
Speaker:of content
Speaker:I guess from this episode. Is
Speaker:there some stuff that you've tried in the past that's flopped and that you
Speaker:will never do again? You know, so that we can, so that other people can learn from your
Speaker:mistakes. There's certain things you think, I'll give this a try. And you go either, that
Speaker:either didn't work in terms of like numbers or
Speaker:Yeah. And I've got a funny story. I went to
Speaker:the Audi dealership by Britannia Stadium and
Speaker:I was talking to the guy there. We were actually getting a car for my dad, not me.
Speaker:he was telling us a story, he had no idea what I did for a living, but
Speaker:he was telling us a story about how he'd had a TikToker girl
Speaker:come to the showroom and say, um, I want a,
Speaker:an Audi RS6. And he was like, Oh, are
Speaker:you sure that's the one that you want? Are you sure that's the, cause he was a young girl. He said, she's
Speaker:probably about 18 or something like that. Are you sure that's the one that you want?
Speaker:And she was like, yeah, that's definitely the one I want. And he was like, well, you
Speaker:do realize, you know, it's a, it's a, it's a lot of money. And,
Speaker:uh, And she was just like, well, my
Speaker:accountant says I can do it because of my TikToks doing really
Speaker:well. Anyway, I've started the story and I can't remember the question. What
Speaker:have you done that's flopped? Yeah, yeah. And
Speaker:so I was like, when he was telling me this story, I was like, what? is
Speaker:that girl doing online that's getting this RS6. Whatever
Speaker:she's doing, I'm going to give a go. You know, that is
Speaker:a no brainer. And he said that it was selling products
Speaker:through TikTok shop. Okay. Okay. And I knew about that
Speaker:already. And I've seen that people are having success with it, but I didn't know
Speaker:how much success. Anyway, there was a couple of
Speaker:times where I made content specifically
Speaker:to sell a product and maybe
Speaker:it's the way I delivered it and or
Speaker:it like because the it like the lack of authenticity maybe
Speaker:came through maybe that was a me thing don't know but
Speaker:either way those videos absolutely dropped off a cliff and
Speaker:they're the worst videos I've ever posted and yeah and
Speaker:This is the thing with marketing, as you know, it's test, test,
Speaker:test. And if it didn't work, it's great. Move on. I'm better for knowing
Speaker:that now. Because let's be honest, you know, I don't think there's anything wrong with
Speaker:selling on TikTok. I think it's absolutely fine. We're all here to make a living. How
Speaker:you do it is completely up to you. And I find there's
Speaker:a lot of snobbery in the social media world that I think is, you
Speaker:know, I keep saying the word objectively today. What's wrong with me, Caelan? I
Speaker:just sort of think, well, we're all kind of businesses. Your
Speaker:tactics on how you make a living is entirely up to you. I can
Speaker:give you some unsolicited advice on how
Speaker:that's perceived in the wider world, but do you. I don't
Speaker:see it being an issue. It's quite a lot of
Speaker:people that take issue on like boosting posts and stuff, and I just sort of think, let
Speaker:I mean, I literally would do what you want when it comes to that
Speaker:type of selling or boosting or anything like that. It
Speaker:works for your business, it works for your business. I have always taken the
Speaker:Mr. Beast strategy, that if people aren't watching your
Speaker:content, it's because it's shit. and that's just
Speaker:the truth yeah it is true like you know you're not getting a
Speaker:million views you're not worth a million views simple
Speaker:as that absolutely and you can cry about it or
Speaker:you can get better at it yeah that's a really really good
Speaker:that I've often had to struggle with with brands. So
Speaker:you've got, let's say we put, and
Speaker:this is kind of hopefully going to lead me really nicely into my next question. You
Speaker:have these two types of content. And as the owner of
Speaker:a social media agency, I have to kind of educate our clients on things.
Speaker:There's content that's engaging that gets you nothing. There
Speaker:is no end net
Speaker:result, positive result from this particular content regardless
Speaker:of the fact that it's actually got a lot of engagement. And
Speaker:there's content that's incredibly valuable from
Speaker:the point of view of selling a particular product that gets zero engagement because
Speaker:it's not, the engagement isn't needed on that post, it's not
Speaker:required. And that's
Speaker:something that I've always felt like has had to be kind of educated
Speaker:into our clients because we typically make the
Speaker:content that gets very little engagement as an agency. It will
Speaker:still get some, it will still get, you know, great, decent numbers. Nowhere near an
Speaker:influencer's numbers because your
Speaker:content is almost like reliant on, to some extent, engagement. Views,
Speaker:clicks, likes, and stuff like that. Whereas we can put like a glossy ad
Speaker:out uh or an advertisement for a particular product it
Speaker:doesn't need obviously it's great if it does get engagement but for the most part we're
Speaker:educating the audience on this is a cool new product and some of the best
Speaker:ads you ever see get very little engagement but it still works yeah
Speaker:i wasn't compelled to go great tool you know what i mean i like
Speaker:these yeah it just didn't add this content like that that
Speaker:just kind of doesn't work and i'm and i'm okay with that But
Speaker:it kind of leads me on to the next question because you've kind of worked in both areas. You
Speaker:are now a content creator that makes your own content for your audience but
Speaker:also for and with paid
Speaker:brand deals and stuff like that. That's how content
Speaker:creators make a living a lot of the time or through like ad
Speaker:revenue. Yeah. But you've been
Speaker:on the side of marketing brands and you understand how
Speaker:brands have to go between the
Speaker:kind of glossy content, promo, catalogs, all that kind
Speaker:of stuff. How do you feel like influencer
Speaker:content and let's call it let's call it dissident content for lack of a
Speaker:better word even though we work a lot with content creators in our
Speaker:own work let's let's assume that we only ever made like glossy stuff
Speaker:with models for instance how do those two kind of fit together in
Speaker:a modern world especially in the construction industry which is kind of in its infancy when
Speaker:it comes to things like this like i think this is a really good educational point oh
Speaker:man so uh i'll there's a lot to unpack with
Speaker:what you've just said um so we can get into it i
Speaker:basically with I'd say 60% of
Speaker:the brands that I speak to, to begin with, have only ever done
Speaker:the glossy stuff. Maybe more than 60%. We've
Speaker:never even thought about influencer marketing, let alone putting the
Speaker:budget to one side and having a plan and a strategy to
Speaker:work with influencers. But having worked on both sides,
Speaker:I've been asked, I've asked businesses like
Speaker:Dissident to create glossy marketing materials,
Speaker:which always come back amazing. And it's always an amazing portfolio piece
Speaker:that you want your customers to see because it gives a
Speaker:really great example of what the product or service that you're offering. And
Speaker:that's like your core, that's your hub. That's when someone's interested
Speaker:in what it is that you are selling. That's what I
Speaker:always found. But the problem is, you need
Speaker:to get somebody interested first and you need
Speaker:to have that awareness. It's all that awareness interest funnel
Speaker:and you know desire and all those touch points. But that awareness sphere
Speaker:is it's an expensive sphere for a brand to
Speaker:be in and if you're not careful you can do it in the wrong
Speaker:way. So You know, when I was
Speaker:doing all of my research, when I worked in the corporate world,
Speaker:all I broke it down to was, what's going to give you the most bang
Speaker:for your buck? And so what's going to give you the most views
Speaker:with your target audience for the amount of money you're spending? And
Speaker:without a doubt, when I looked at all of it,
Speaker:it came down to influencers. Because at the end
Speaker:of the day, you are creating
Speaker:something with somebody who is, they might not
Speaker:be a creative agency, so they might not have all the special cameras and
Speaker:they might not be able to make the glossy pieces, but they're definitely making
Speaker:something that people are resonating with. And they've got proof of that.
Speaker:Because they've been doing it for years, they've got the following and they get the engagement and the numbers. So
Speaker:you can rely on them to do that work for you. They
Speaker:can create the content and share it and get the
Speaker:reach. And if you choose the right influencers, you
Speaker:also kind of piggyback off their authenticity as
Speaker:well. And that's a big deal. You know, there's a lot of
Speaker:brands that don't consider when you're doing business with
Speaker:an influencer that they are
Speaker:risking their authenticity by backing your brand or products. So
Speaker:there's that element. Those two go together really well.
Speaker:You hook somebody in with your influencer work or
Speaker:even a little in-house setup that your staff can do. There's
Speaker:loads of really good examples on TikTok especially of
Speaker:where like an in-house marketing team have just gone and done like some really crazy
Speaker:raw footage stuff and it's worked. It doesn't always
Speaker:work though. And then obviously when someone's interested, they
Speaker:come through to a brand page where there's like 50% of
Speaker:it is, or maybe more is the glossy stuff. You learn
Speaker:more about the brand, the products, the services, the people behind it.
Speaker:They go to the website, maybe it's a little bit more higher
Speaker:spec there. So you're getting like really into longer form glossy videos
Speaker:then. And then you've sold your product or service. So
Speaker:It's kind of like, it was taught to me in, In
Speaker:university, it's the difference between advertising and, sorry,
Speaker:an advert and a corporate video. So an advert is
Speaker:something that grabs your attention when you weren't looking for
Speaker:it. So that could be influencer marketing, it could be obviously a paid campaign
Speaker:or something like that. Advertising is very much a case of
Speaker:like, I wasn't looking for this thing, and now it's found its
Speaker:way to me. So that could be again, through influencers and stuff like that.
Speaker:Whereas a corporate video is something that you create for
Speaker:people who have already shown interest. So that's where you go for
Speaker:your more information, your details, you want to get excited
Speaker:about the specs and you want to see like
Speaker:the glossy video with the clever lighting
Speaker:and the beautiful graphics and the breakdowns of the tool
Speaker:But brands make the mistake of asking influencers to
Speaker:They try and make influencers do a corporate video. Yes. Yeah. Which breaks
Speaker:authenticity. And it's completely, it completely flops.
Speaker:What about the hybrid? So we, so, so I
Speaker:like, I like leaving. So I've said this
Speaker:on the podcast before. We're very
Speaker:much governed by our clients. We'll guide them in
Speaker:some respects into what we think is right. But eventually, they're
Speaker:paying. So we'll say, let those
Speaker:guys, let the influencers be
Speaker:influencers. Let them do their thing. Put in a loose contract. Put
Speaker:in loose terms. And because they're
Speaker:not an agency, they can't just go and make a thing if it doesn't exist
Speaker:yet. Most of the time, these steel guys have still got jobs.
Speaker:Let those guys do their thing, let it be raw, let it be unfiltered, and let
Speaker:it be them. Let us do us our thing. And then
Speaker:there's like this sweet spot in the middle where we're like, you know, that, like,
Speaker:that's that, you know, we've got, let's say, four or
Speaker:five ambassadors for this particular brand. Let's bring those guys in
Speaker:for our um high production content um
Speaker:and we can kind of combine the two we can do something where that you
Speaker:know that's going out on our platform though we could go out on theirs if you wanted
Speaker:to because that you know there's again you don't want to break the consistency of
Speaker:having if you're all of your content is a has a
Speaker:particular look and then didn't make a film that looks wildly
Speaker:different. You might want to share it for a little bit and get rid of it off the
Speaker:feed or something like that. Have you had much experience
Speaker:in kind of that element where you've kind of gone like, and I saw the guys that
Speaker:I've heard of it, yeah. That kind of clever thing of let's not use
Speaker:models, let's use actual personalities and
Speaker:So I am only in this game, I've only been
Speaker:in this influencer game a few, you know, a couple of years now. And
Speaker:so it's only, it's taken me at least a year to get in front of brands
Speaker:which might be making those types of decisions, right. And so
Speaker:just coming at it from an influencer point of view, I have
Speaker:delivered content. So I've delivered a speech to
Speaker:a camera in front of a room full of people, off
Speaker:the cuff, let's say, and then use
Speaker:that for like YouTube videos or whatever. And it's only when a brand sees
Speaker:you do that as a content creator, they're like, okay
Speaker:then. that's a skill that we don't have in-house, we
Speaker:would have to pay an actor or a model or somebody to do that for
Speaker:us. How can we now then include that person in
Speaker:our more corporate stuff, our interest videos. So
Speaker:you then I guess you ring fencing a group of influencers who
Speaker:are part of your awareness team and then maybe picking
Speaker:a couple of those influencers out and just, just putting
Speaker:Yeah. Into the corporate side of things. And that's kind of, that's okay.
Speaker:As long as it's done the right way, I suppose. It has to be done the right way.
Speaker:But for example, like This is
Speaker:a tricky situation to be in when you're sponsored as
Speaker:an influencer by a brand. So I've got two main sponsors right
Speaker:now, Dewalt and CT1. And I
Speaker:personally chose to work with them because I,
Speaker:for example, Dewalt, I've used them since day one. They are
Speaker:a great tool brand. Everyone knows it. It's an
Speaker:amazing opportunity to work with them and be sponsored by them. CT1, they
Speaker:are an unbelievable product, probably the best sealant
Speaker:and adhesive in the industry and I say that without worrying about
Speaker:the repercussions because it actually is at
Speaker:the moment anyway. So why not work with that
Speaker:best if I can and luckily I've got
Speaker:them as a sponsor so I work with them and that hopefully my
Speaker:authenticity isn't compromised because although yes I
Speaker:am working closely with a company and I'm using their
Speaker:products and tools in the content that I make. it
Speaker:I genuinely believe in those things anyway. And it's
Speaker:about and it's about delivering that to your audience and making sure
Speaker:that they understand that I and all
Speaker:influencers should do this. I'm not going to sell out and
Speaker:just become someone who pushes for no reason just like
Speaker:I think it's an interesting one and it's one that crops up
Speaker:in a conversation I had the other day with a potential brand.
Speaker:And we went through some idea development, and they were
Speaker:looking to do some, they're like
Speaker:a tool brand that does like a ton and ton of different power tools and
Speaker:stuff like that. And we were coming up
Speaker:with this concept of like, having a presenter, someone
Speaker:who's like, in the field, not one of the sales guys, someone
Speaker:who's actually kind of on the tours to talk about
Speaker:the like their massive range of tours, have them available
Speaker:on a regular basis that can talk well to
Speaker:camera, presents well, and has
Speaker:availability to be going for multiple shoot days and stuff. And
Speaker:it's got to be a content creator, it's got to be an influencer, it's got to
Speaker:be the one and it's like, you
Speaker:know, somebody who can go in and build a studio, build a set,
Speaker:and be able to shoot, I don't know, 15 videos
Speaker:in a day, just knock out a load of content on these particular tools.
Speaker:And I'm seeing that more and more is that
Speaker:is this kind of this the need for essentially like
Speaker:an ambassador in some respects, but one that
Speaker:can actually come in and do professional, you
Speaker:know, kind of like, not really adverts, but you know what I mean, like almost a QVC
Speaker:style. This is this and this is how it then do some demos, but have
Speaker:that be consistent. And I think Ambassador is
Speaker:the way forward in that kind of thing. Someone who's like, not only gels with
Speaker:the brand, but knows the product and knows the applications
Speaker:and can relate to the end user in that respect. The
Speaker:trouble is with that is like how close they
Speaker:are to the brand or whether this product is going to be filmed and
Speaker:you know some of the best ambassadors are miles away from
Speaker:where the studio is and stuff like that. That's the thing that
Speaker:we find really really tricky. And maybe
Speaker:we can get Dewalt or something on some kind
Speaker:of like ambassador, like long, like
Speaker:regular YouTube studio type content because I
Speaker:think you're the only person locally to us that we know
Speaker:to do that kind of thing. But that's a big thing is having content
Speaker:creators that you know do well in
Speaker:Yeah, so there's an example of that. There's a guy called
Speaker:Simon Bowling. I have a lot of respect for that guy. Milwaukee guys. Yeah,
Speaker:he is Milwaukee and he is acting as
Speaker:kind of like an ambassador on their behalf because he does his own content
Speaker:but he also films for them as well. So he
Speaker:does that. He's going from that awareness to that interest
Speaker:bubble and creating the more glossy stuff. and the brand comes
Speaker:down with all their cameras or the agency that they hire comes
Speaker:down with the cameras and does a proper shoot. I know as
Speaker:an influencer and as a presenter he likes that type of stuff
Speaker:and I've had opportunities like that
Speaker:sent my way as well. Really the
Speaker:only people I want to be doing that for are D.Walt. so
Speaker:I'm looking for an opportunity to be doing that with DeWalt. They
Speaker:already have two guys that do a similar thing
Speaker:for them and I didn't know that
Speaker:until I recently went to their headquarters but those guys are
Speaker:People who have been in the trade a long time and they've just built a
Speaker:relationship with Dewalt and now they use
Speaker:the products. They're almost like in-house product experts. They can
Speaker:talk to video. I think the issue that they've got there is
Speaker:that these in-house product experts don't actually have any following. There's
Speaker:no way of reach. And they're not content creation experts. So
Speaker:although they might know the tools, and they
Speaker:can deliver to a camera, they can't do any of the
Speaker:rest of it, which means they would still have to post it through an
Speaker:advertisement, which would cost a lot of money or something like that. or
Speaker:just put it on the brand's social media channel. So for me, a
Speaker:next step for me, my relationship with Dewalt next
Speaker:year, logical conclusion would be that I can do some videos for
Speaker:them on the more glossy side and talk about the products and what
Speaker:they're used for and all that type of stuff and actually help that be
Speaker:Because you get the best of both worlds and you've got a brand
Speaker:ambassador, you know the gear. you're on the tools, but
Speaker:also you can bring that clout, that social media clout. So you've got the double
Speaker:whammy there of like, not only is this a great piece of content that
Speaker:can live on its own, but also your following can kind of come
Speaker:They have their, they have like a Dewalt van, which
Speaker:is well, a van, it's a lorry. and it's all kitted out
Speaker:and it looks ace and I don't know if they made content in
Speaker:that but that kind of made me think about well if
Speaker:you have a van or just like say it's a motorhome for
Speaker:example. I've seen these at some like golf days and stuff where the
Speaker:brands go and like a famous player might go into them
Speaker:and have all the clubs fitted out on the day and all that type of stuff. So
Speaker:why can't somebody create one of those as like a podcast and
Speaker:YouTube studio like you're on about and then someone just has to
Speaker:drive it to wherever that location is, park it up for a week,
Speaker:do a load of content, you know, maybe that works. It'd be
Speaker:better if it was a building. But yeah, there's options.
Speaker:A building in the Midlands perhaps in central Staffordshire, you
Speaker:I'll see what they say. Yeah cheers mate, I appreciate that.
Speaker:That's the only reason why we do this podcast is so we can
Speaker:I say now you've delivered it now, now get down to
Speaker:Mate it's been an absolute pleasure, it's been a proper eye opener as well to
Speaker:your process and I think that's going to be really valuable to the audiences that
Speaker:kind of the behind the scenes of
Speaker:the process and what goes into making, um,
Speaker:not, not only your content, but building your audience and kind of what, what
Speaker:you had to do and sacrifice to do that. And also I think it's, um,
Speaker:it's. It's surprising and nice to hear the
Speaker:story of it. It didn't, it wasn't really
Speaker:a strategy initially. It just, it happened, a
Speaker:few amazing things happened at one time and you were like, this is cool. I'm
Speaker:going to continue on this thread. Have you
Speaker:got any last questions, Keelen? What's
Speaker:So there's been a few ideas floating
Speaker:around on this subject and To be honest,
Speaker:I'm yet to nail one fully down. So
Speaker:the ideas are... I have
Speaker:to basically dig down to what it is that I personally really
Speaker:want to do. Because the ideas can go off so many
Speaker:different directions. If I wanted to do something just for views and
Speaker:clout, I would move to Canada and build a
Speaker:log cabin on the side of a lake by myself, living
Speaker:off just tuna. Do you know what I mean? And it's like, I'm
Speaker:the sort of guy with the drive and motivation that could go and do that. Like,
Speaker:if I really needed to, I would do. Would I enjoy it? No. Do
Speaker:I want to do that in my career right now? No. So I need to find
Speaker:out where the middle point is of like, what
Speaker:it is that I want to do, but is also interesting to the public. And
Speaker:there's a variation of ideas that I've got going on and
Speaker:I think though whatever it is that I am going to choose will
Speaker:need to begin at least summertime
Speaker:2025. It's got to begin then and no later because my house is
Speaker:coming to a point where it's getting close to
Speaker:completion and like anyone who owns a house knows there's a million and
Speaker:one jobs you can keep doing forever. I can keep improving things
Speaker:that don't always need improving but for me personally
Speaker:I like renovating things or building things completely
Speaker:from scratch. So it's either if you were to really kind
Speaker:of narrow it down, next steps could be a really cool
Speaker:concept house. So something that's like really battered or
Speaker:very old or something like that that needs renovation or
Speaker:a very interesting new build. And
Speaker:So the problem that Scott DIY has got is
Speaker:I mean that's a big problem to have though isn't it? You know, like
Speaker:you physically, like your content is based around renovating a
Speaker:Well the benefit for me is, I mean there's loads of benefits in
Speaker:terms of like my business, you know, earning the
Speaker:money and doing and all that type of stuff. But for me,
Speaker:I love to make things and restore things and stuff
Speaker:like that. So I've got to play into that because there's
Speaker:a big difference between someone who's behind a camera who's
Speaker:saying, I'm doing this today, or someone who's like genuinely passionate
Speaker:and I'm like, I'm doing this today, you know, like, I can't wait
Speaker:to get involved in this. I've never done it before, but we're going to give it the best shot.
Speaker:And that's who I want to be in my content. Like I have been up
Speaker:It's got to be it's got to be like passion driven. You've got to be like, come along for
Speaker:the journey. This is what I'm doing. Yeah. Well, I'm excited for
Speaker:whatever comes your way, Scott. I really appreciate you sharing
Speaker:your story and some of the behind the scenes of how
Speaker:you get to 408k on Instagram and long
Speaker:may that growth continue. We look forward
Speaker:to seeing your more long form
Speaker:stuff on on YouTube as well. I'm looking forward to getting my
Speaker:teeth into that. I think that's it. Kieran, isn't it? We're
Speaker:good. You got any more questions? Is there anything that
Speaker:I should have asked you that you feel like you were dying to
Speaker:There's probably two things. Okay. And they're not big things. Okay. But
Speaker:it's about, so it's just from my side of
Speaker:being an influencer and getting asked a lot by content
Speaker:creators who might not have grown so quickly or are
Speaker:on this content creation journey and they ask, sorry,
Speaker:and they ask, How do I
Speaker:get what you've got? How do I grow so quickly? How do I learn
Speaker:what you've learned? What is the secret sauce? What's the shortcut? Yeah,
Speaker:what's the shortcut? And I think it's a really important
Speaker:message to say to those people that it
Speaker:really is a short-term pain, long-term gain
Speaker:scenario. You're going to work for a year getting
Speaker:nothing at least before you start seeing some return
Speaker:on the time investment you know and then over
Speaker:that and then eventually you'll start picking picking bits
Speaker:up and you can try and run with it as best you can but it is it's a painful
Speaker:game to be in and and the second thing is probably
Speaker:on the flip side so it's like from brand perspective it's
Speaker:the I did kind of briefly touch on it before the Brands
Speaker:don't know much about influencer marketing. Especially not in construction. Especially
Speaker:not in construction. And they should start to
Speaker:learn about it. Learn about it now, before your competitors
Speaker:are doing it. Get that edge, create content, get
Speaker:viral views, and get your brand out there. quickly
Speaker:and easily and the more you learn about it now as well it's going to put that
Speaker:brand in a better position because there's a
Speaker:lot of people who may be older in the construction industry they're
Speaker:a bit scared of what this influencer thing is are they going to be taken for a
Speaker:mug by somebody because it's a person at the end of the day and
Speaker:they're not going to get the value out of it but you only learn
Speaker:by doing in life. Yes. And when it's proven to
Speaker:be one of the biggest marketing channels in the world and it's only growing
Speaker:its billions and now being invested into marketing for
Speaker:influencers you've got to get ahead of that curve or
Speaker:Yeah, absolutely. I think 2025 is going to be a big
Speaker:year for influencer marketing for brands. We're seeing
Speaker:the trend in the conversations that we're having, not just with
Speaker:our clients, but prospective clients. You know, they're coming to us
Speaker:because they see that we've got relationships with a
Speaker:good network of influencers. And that's almost been like an in, an
Speaker:accidental in with these brands. and
Speaker:it's absolutely massive. One of the things that I keep meaning
Speaker:to touch on but I haven't because I don't really know what the answer is to this kind of thing but
Speaker:it's something that I might just briefly bring up just right at the end of this episode
Speaker:is brand exclusivity is
Speaker:one of the challenges with especially construction because
Speaker:there's a lot of brands that will
Speaker:do a multitude of different products, that
Speaker:actually kind of push themselves into different product verticals. And
Speaker:they might only do like one or two products in that particular range. But
Speaker:then that, if you're a, let's say a Dewalt guy,
Speaker:and they bring out a product that is something
Speaker:that's aligned with another type of brand that you want
Speaker:to work with, And then you've got kind of almost like an exclusivity kind
Speaker:of thing with DeWalt that kind of blocks you out of that market. What's
Speaker:the solution to that, do you think? I'm still trying to struggle apart from the fact that
Speaker:you have contracts that say, listen, like I will
Speaker:work with you on these particular types of things. You have
Speaker:a range of products here. I'm going to work with you in this range here because I want the options
Speaker:to do that kind of thing. Have you thought about that and discussed that with brands in
Speaker:I haven't had to discuss it really. I've only had to discuss it
Speaker:once but exclusivity is
Speaker:expensive for the brand. Expensive and
Speaker:it should be because the influencer is losing a
Speaker:lot of money. So I did a, I did a, I got
Speaker:asked by a brand, very well-known tool brand, not Dewalt,
Speaker:to do, be exclusive with them on their tools
Speaker:which also included hand tools. So
Speaker:not just power tools but hand tools. And I
Speaker:calculated, I did a bit of a cost breakdown.
Speaker:It wasn't really anything too scientific about how much
Speaker:I could potentially lose my business over the year just
Speaker:through other collaborations. Not that, so that isn't
Speaker:the price of what I would be just for what
Speaker:they want me to do. That's what I will lose. So that's just added
Speaker:Yeah, yeah, there's a term for that, isn't there? It's
Speaker:Yeah, yeah, that's it. So it's kind of like based on what I've
Speaker:had in the past and even the growth that I'm looking at
Speaker:anyway, like how much is that going to be? It was a
Speaker:significant fee, you know, and I was surprised to
Speaker:see that number. But the numbers don't lie, like I
Speaker:didn't make it up to myself, you know, I wasn't making it up as I was working at
Speaker:home. You know, I was just surprised to see it. So when
Speaker:I went back to the brand, I knew how they react. And while
Speaker:it's safe to say I didn't do exclusivity with them. And to be honest,
Speaker:I didn't really want the exclusivity at
Speaker:that point with that brand. It was just too far
Speaker:of a stretch. If they pay me all that money, I would have probably sat back
Speaker:and gone, going on holiday, you know. What's expected
Speaker:of me. Yeah, exactly. But now they're going to want blood, you know, for
Speaker:that sort of money. But as, you know, my
Speaker:journey progresses and as my following increases and the community
Speaker:gets warmer and the brands that I work with are more
Speaker:aligned with me, that exclusivity conversation isn't
Speaker:as scary. And because I have the big platform, the
Speaker:Yeah, I think that's massive. The
Speaker:concern is, you know, DeWalt bring out an adhesive and
Speaker:you go, we're working with a bloody adhesive company, you know, or
Speaker:whatever. And like, so it gets a bit dodgy. And, you
Speaker:know, I was speaking to another brand, I can't remember who it
Speaker:was the other day, and they were saying like, everybody's doing it, you know, this, this,
Speaker:you know, this trends in construction, where brands are
Speaker:bringing out sort of ancillary, ancillary
Speaker:project products, I don't even know if that's the right term. But
Speaker:they're usually in this vertical, and they're kind of branched out into this vertical,
Speaker:they're going to have making a big push on that. And we're like, why there's already, there's
Speaker:already big players in here, but it may it makes it quite difficult for
Speaker:the for the content creators and we've experienced this where
Speaker:So I would put this to a brand and say and
Speaker:I have put this to brands and say one of the best things about
Speaker:me and my account is my authenticity The reason why
Speaker:that is is because I'm not like this isn't a DeWalt showroom. And
Speaker:for example, there's just there isn't a DeWalt poster
Speaker:behind me. I'm not wearing all DeWalt clothes. And don't
Speaker:get me wrong. All of the clothes are amazing. The tools are amazing, all
Speaker:that sort of stuff. But there are times where you want to use a
Speaker:different clothing or a different brand for any other reason
Speaker:than just it looks cool or it's your style, whatever
Speaker:it could be. So and that actually contributes to
Speaker:your authenticity. So if you want
Speaker:people to believe in the influence that you're working with, what you're paying
Speaker:Amazing. Amazing. Scott, we're gonna have to wrap it up there because Keelan's
Speaker:given me the no, we've got zero minutes. Thank you
Speaker:so much, mate. It's been an absolute pleasure to
